USA Prices

[BritArms]

What the hells going on over here. Last week a very tidy Interceptor only made $41500 on BAT, And today a good look 383 only made $21500.

[kees]

The bubble has burst!!

[felixkk]

Not much different over here. First Covid, then Ukraine, inflation, uncertain future etc... the last thing a lot of people are thinking about at the moment is classic cars.

[WIL]

Hi,

You are correct to say that there are some 'negative' factors affecting the market, however my view and current experience is that the classic car scene in the UK is currently very buoyant, and that sales both private and at auctions have been achieving some good results.

Wil

[Jens]

Not much different over here. First Covid, then Ukraine, inflation, uncertain future etc... the last thing a lot of people are thinking about at the moment is classic cars.

I am dealing with classic British cars as well as German ones.

Over the years I ALWAYS sold very well restored examples of Mercedes Benz R107 or R129 (500 SL, 560 SL) to retired people in their early or mid 60s. Price range 30 - 60k€.

"Now I have the time and the money to fulfill a long-standing dream." was the standard motivation. These were not really rich people but this money they had on their hands and were willing to invest in a dream. These guys are absolutely quiet in the past 12 months although the people and the money are still there. They are not parting with their money due to the uncertainties we're all facing at the moment.

The range above 250k is still in good shape because people buying cars for that amount of money don't have these issues. But the medium range (20 - 100k) is very well under pressure as a number of people are trying to sell their cars and less are buying at the moment.

Difficult times, I hope it will change for the better again.

[Mark1Stu]

Useful insight Jens.

Thanks for sharing.

Stuart

[Chris_R]

The range above 250k is still in good shape because people buying cars for that amount of money don't have these issues.

Witness a Ford Sierra Cosworth RS500 that sold recently for over £596,000. Apparently earning the auction house £66,000 . Nice work if you can get it.

[felixkk]

Imagine showing up at a meet in that car with everyone else in their posh Ferraris, Miuras, Bentley Blowers, McLarens, DB whatever...

[Steve Payne]

The range above 250k is still in good shape because people buying cars for that amount of money don't have these issues.

Witness a Ford Sierra Cosworth RS500 that sold recently for over £596,000. Apparently earning the auction house £66,000 . Nice work if you can get it.

Yes a new record for one of these and at the same auction a Sierra Saphire Cosworth fetched £110k and a Cosworth Escort £65k, the RS500 did only have 5000 miles on it but the Sierra Saphire had 10,000 miles and the Escort nearly 50,000. You can sort of understand if one person wants it but two people with that kind of money to spend on a car that they are unlikely to ever use is crazy.
Who ever thought a Capri would be a £50k car, there are several on the market in that area and yes I know they might not achieve it but it was not that long ago a Capri was a sub £5k car even for the best.
We are in an odd place at the moment, new ICE cars are no longer going to be sold new in the UK in 7 years and I think some people realise that if they want that ''dream car'' if they dont do it soon its not going to happen.

Steve

[johnw]

Imagine showing up at a meet in that car with everyone else in their posh Ferraris, Miuras, Bentley Blowers, McLarens, DB whatever...

Andrew Cassar had one of those Fords I believe. It was in a classic magazine article 20 years ago and it sounded like he was the owner. I wonder if he still had it when he died? He who dies with the most toys wins! He certainly had a manual CV8 and an SP.

[johnw]

Useful insight Jens.

Thanks for sharing.

Stuart

Indeed. I'm wondering where FFs stand in the firing line? I'm new to this game and have a cash buyer in the lower price range you mentioned Jens. I found him a Ferrari last year. He is still waiting with a small stash, and asks about Interceptors. I am pushing him towards an FF as I suspect I will get to drive it a lot. Will something as good as Keith Andrews' gorgeous red FF pop up again around the £50k mark or less? Are FFs now "Home and dry" around £100k?

[Mark1Stu]

I’ve been keeping an eye on prices not least because I have an FF which I shall sell at some point.

My impression is it’s currently a terrible time to sell a car such as ours, for good money. The market for our cars is currently cool with limited interested buyers - many of whom aren’t fully aware of what an excellent Jensen should look like - let alone how it should perform. So a seller with an exceptional Jensen risks giving it away should they need to off load now. Exacerbated by there being such a wide price range for our cars (I’m talking Interceptors in particular). The club could do more to narrow that gap whilst still being inclusive. But that’s another conversation.

Currently, I see prices for FFs in the UK at circa £80k (starting) up to £125k (advertised but whether they sell close to that is less clear at present). Exceptional examples with good provenance could go for more, but good luck finding a discerning buyer.

I think the red FF sold too cheaply - but that was the £££ that was around at the time. Rust of course is the Interceptors/FFs biggest enemy - along with poor choices on restoration which can leave previously good cars with fit and finish looking like a kit car. The FF, with its chassis tubes on the outside of the platform, is more costly to restore, which can (and should) impact on value given high restoration costs. All this compounded by price guides reflecting auction values only (even though I’ve read ‘they’ also research private/trade sales….I just don’t believe that) which mainly feature the poor to average examples (even if they are dressed up as something else).

I’m not suggesting that red FF falls into the category of rusty etc car mentioned above.

The only Interceptors (and perhaps FFs) which make money these days (or until recently at least) are finds which either are sent to auction or bought at auction and then flipped on eBay. That is the £10-15k car which gets flipped for £25k ish…..only for the new less knowledgeable owner to get hit with the costs of proper repair and building in reliability. None of which helps the marques reputation. With this in mind and better Jensens generally slow to sell, its perhaps not surprising that the high end car trade arent particularly interested in selling them - when they can make a faster buck on something more mainstream…..

All said, I adore everything about owning and driving a Jensen and the company’s history. I’m more than content to let the sheep following masses buy an old Jag, Porsche, Merc etc. While they may be much sounder investments (and they’re good cars of course)….I pretend Im a much more discerning classic car owner

Just my thoughts. I’m sure others will rightly have their own take on this.

[colin7673]

Good points made Stu. Restoration of a car to the unknown will put many people off and we have all seen half restored cars for sale because of either cost or loss of interest.

Some of the trouble is their are those that can restore a car and those that think they can.

[felixkk]

The clubs need to get the prices paid from their members and the specialists dealing with Jensens- in all discretion of course. We were just today communicated a price from a private sale by a member for a condition 2 car (the sale was this year), a solid/excellent car. Close to 100% more than the particular model is valued at over here and also in the UK.

[kees]

Spiralling prices is a bad thing for the classic car movement. These old cars need to be driven and tinkered with to enjoy. Once prices are rising the investors are coming in and many classic cars disappear in storage not to be driven and enjoyed.
In the past decades prices were hugely inflated. I do hope they come down to realistic prices.