Name that car
Re: Name that car
Delage DE?
Dave Turnage
Colchester
JOC 8674
JOC 541 Registrar
541S, 100/1061
541R, 6002/387 (now in lots of pieces!)
Alvis speed 25 DHC
Colchester
JOC 8674
JOC 541 Registrar
541S, 100/1061
541R, 6002/387 (now in lots of pieces!)
Alvis speed 25 DHC
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Re: Name that car
Yes very clever Dave. The gent second from left was the brother of the first owner of H12.
Jensen S-Type Tourer 1938 S44
Alvis Speed 25 SC Charlesworth Saloon 1938
Mercedes CL 600 V12 2001
Used to own 1938 S-Type Tourer S34, CV8 MkII 104/2229 and CV8 MkIII 112/2457
Author of Jensen: The Surviving 3 1/2 & 4 1/4 Litre Cars
Alvis Speed 25 SC Charlesworth Saloon 1938
Mercedes CL 600 V12 2001
Used to own 1938 S-Type Tourer S34, CV8 MkII 104/2229 and CV8 MkIII 112/2457
Author of Jensen: The Surviving 3 1/2 & 4 1/4 Litre Cars
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Re: Name that car
Back in 2010, during Mike Williams' legendary reign as Early Cars Registrar (every time I get the old magazines out I find myself diverted for a few hours re-reading all his wonderful articles), he challenged me to find out more about the car below. A few decades before this record cover photo was taken, the car had been advertised in Motor Sport in the 1960s with a photo. There was just a phone number. I set to work. As is often the case, a simple question led to an unexpected goldmine of information . . . more later. What exactly is this car?
Jensen S-Type Tourer 1938 S44
Alvis Speed 25 SC Charlesworth Saloon 1938
Mercedes CL 600 V12 2001
Used to own 1938 S-Type Tourer S34, CV8 MkII 104/2229 and CV8 MkIII 112/2457
Author of Jensen: The Surviving 3 1/2 & 4 1/4 Litre Cars
Alvis Speed 25 SC Charlesworth Saloon 1938
Mercedes CL 600 V12 2001
Used to own 1938 S-Type Tourer S34, CV8 MkII 104/2229 and CV8 MkIII 112/2457
Author of Jensen: The Surviving 3 1/2 & 4 1/4 Litre Cars
Re: Name that car
David
Possibly a 1935 Rolls-Royce Phantom II 3-position dhc
(note the "Continental" style louvres to the bonnet sides and no side mounted spare tyres, perhaps the elusive all weather model)
The front valance strangely modified which makes me wonder?
Best
Simon
Possibly a 1935 Rolls-Royce Phantom II 3-position dhc
(note the "Continental" style louvres to the bonnet sides and no side mounted spare tyres, perhaps the elusive all weather model)
The front valance strangely modified which makes me wonder?
Best
Simon
Last edited by SRD on Mon Aug 16, 2021 6:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
- VFK44
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Re: Name that car
I was guessing a Jensen 'S' type.
Either modified with a Rolls-Royce grille and lights, or "photoshopped" with scissors and paste!--------------------
Either modified with a Rolls-Royce grille and lights, or "photoshopped" with scissors and paste!--------------------
"Now that chassis number is particularly interesting ‘cos it’s the one after the one before, which is the one after mine, not many people know that"
Stephen, Epping, Essex
Stephen, Epping, Essex
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Re: Name that car
Inspired guesses, SRD and VKF44, but no. Here is another photo from the 1960s
Jensen S-Type Tourer 1938 S44
Alvis Speed 25 SC Charlesworth Saloon 1938
Mercedes CL 600 V12 2001
Used to own 1938 S-Type Tourer S34, CV8 MkII 104/2229 and CV8 MkIII 112/2457
Author of Jensen: The Surviving 3 1/2 & 4 1/4 Litre Cars
Alvis Speed 25 SC Charlesworth Saloon 1938
Mercedes CL 600 V12 2001
Used to own 1938 S-Type Tourer S34, CV8 MkII 104/2229 and CV8 MkIII 112/2457
Author of Jensen: The Surviving 3 1/2 & 4 1/4 Litre Cars
- VFK44
- Co-Administrator
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Re: Name that car
Definitely Jensen where it is visible. Either Jensen built a body on a RR chassis, or it was transferred over after leaving the factory. I've got a feeling that if I'd read all of David's excellent book, instead of just the H type section, I might know more about this!
"Now that chassis number is particularly interesting ‘cos it’s the one after the one before, which is the one after mine, not many people know that"
Stephen, Epping, Essex
Stephen, Epping, Essex
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Re: Name that car
On the right lines VFK44 but needs to be much more specific . . . .
Jensen S-Type Tourer 1938 S44
Alvis Speed 25 SC Charlesworth Saloon 1938
Mercedes CL 600 V12 2001
Used to own 1938 S-Type Tourer S34, CV8 MkII 104/2229 and CV8 MkIII 112/2457
Author of Jensen: The Surviving 3 1/2 & 4 1/4 Litre Cars
Alvis Speed 25 SC Charlesworth Saloon 1938
Mercedes CL 600 V12 2001
Used to own 1938 S-Type Tourer S34, CV8 MkII 104/2229 and CV8 MkIII 112/2457
Author of Jensen: The Surviving 3 1/2 & 4 1/4 Litre Cars
Re: Name that car
Using the assumption this is a rebody:
1929 Rolls-Royce 20 HP possible chassis and running gear and radiator (relatively cheap when a 10 year old car, but good quality, perhaps a severely damaged body or an owner wanting to give the car a makeover with an up to date body style?)
Now I am sticking my neck out of my comfort zone, possibly a 1938 Jensen "S-type body" but possibly made to special order by Jensen Brothers and maybe H type partially as well
(A seemingly wider B-post than H-type and front wing treatment is different)
It was the front windscreen treatment which threw me on a RR body and treatment of front valance and front wings.
1929 Rolls-Royce 20 HP possible chassis and running gear and radiator (relatively cheap when a 10 year old car, but good quality, perhaps a severely damaged body or an owner wanting to give the car a makeover with an up to date body style?)
Now I am sticking my neck out of my comfort zone, possibly a 1938 Jensen "S-type body" but possibly made to special order by Jensen Brothers and maybe H type partially as well
(A seemingly wider B-post than H-type and front wing treatment is different)
It was the front windscreen treatment which threw me on a RR body and treatment of front valance and front wings.
Last edited by SRD on Mon Aug 16, 2021 5:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Name that car
Congratulations SRD! Brilliant analysis.
The advert described the car as a 1929 Rolls Royce 20hp with 'unique coachwork to special order by Jensen Bros'. I would agree that the body seems to be more 'H' rather than 'S' Type, although it is difficult to tell the difference from the bulkhead backwards. It also has an H-Type rear bumper and the double plates and bullet side lights. I would say it was done specially for the car given the unusual front end treatment. Presumably it dates from later 1938 or 1939 when H-Types were being made. Maybe Mike Williams or Richard Calver would take a different view?
Based on research by Mike Williams at the time, it originally had a Hooper Saloon body, the first owner being a Mr Thomas from Fernhill Heath. The advertiser in 1964, who was a motor trader in his early 20s at the time, dealing in cheap Rolls and Bentleys, bought it from a Mr Capewell of Bromsgrove and repainted it from all black to gold with black wings. By 1979, presumably after the record cover picture, the car was in the USA but returned to the UK in the 1990s. Again, according to Mike back in 2010, the body still exists in the hands of a Rolls Royce collector in the West Midlands but the chassis now wears a Tourer body.
Having established the address to which the telephone number in the advert related, I wrote to the current resident who seemed to be from the same family as in 1964. He actually turned out to be the person who had placed the 1964 advert! He immediately started telling me chapter and verse about the car. He also mentioned that his parents had been close to the Jensen Motors director George Mason and his family had a couple of photos of a Jensen when they were visiting Poole with the Masons. These were of H1 waiting at the Sandbanks ferry and then on the Purbecks and are included in my book on page 142. More recently he mentioned that his father owned S24 and related many amusing anecdoes not previously known, again included in the chapter on H1. The family were also able to tell me categorically that the person standing on the running board of H1 in the photo of the car going up Shelsley Walsh was definitely not George Mason. Until that time, no pre-war picture of George Mason was known (at least by me). Subsequently they were able to put me in touch with the Mason family who came up with a wonderful pre-war photo of him.
So from a simple query to research a telephone number, quite a lot came out!
The advert described the car as a 1929 Rolls Royce 20hp with 'unique coachwork to special order by Jensen Bros'. I would agree that the body seems to be more 'H' rather than 'S' Type, although it is difficult to tell the difference from the bulkhead backwards. It also has an H-Type rear bumper and the double plates and bullet side lights. I would say it was done specially for the car given the unusual front end treatment. Presumably it dates from later 1938 or 1939 when H-Types were being made. Maybe Mike Williams or Richard Calver would take a different view?
Based on research by Mike Williams at the time, it originally had a Hooper Saloon body, the first owner being a Mr Thomas from Fernhill Heath. The advertiser in 1964, who was a motor trader in his early 20s at the time, dealing in cheap Rolls and Bentleys, bought it from a Mr Capewell of Bromsgrove and repainted it from all black to gold with black wings. By 1979, presumably after the record cover picture, the car was in the USA but returned to the UK in the 1990s. Again, according to Mike back in 2010, the body still exists in the hands of a Rolls Royce collector in the West Midlands but the chassis now wears a Tourer body.
Having established the address to which the telephone number in the advert related, I wrote to the current resident who seemed to be from the same family as in 1964. He actually turned out to be the person who had placed the 1964 advert! He immediately started telling me chapter and verse about the car. He also mentioned that his parents had been close to the Jensen Motors director George Mason and his family had a couple of photos of a Jensen when they were visiting Poole with the Masons. These were of H1 waiting at the Sandbanks ferry and then on the Purbecks and are included in my book on page 142. More recently he mentioned that his father owned S24 and related many amusing anecdoes not previously known, again included in the chapter on H1. The family were also able to tell me categorically that the person standing on the running board of H1 in the photo of the car going up Shelsley Walsh was definitely not George Mason. Until that time, no pre-war picture of George Mason was known (at least by me). Subsequently they were able to put me in touch with the Mason family who came up with a wonderful pre-war photo of him.
So from a simple query to research a telephone number, quite a lot came out!
Jensen S-Type Tourer 1938 S44
Alvis Speed 25 SC Charlesworth Saloon 1938
Mercedes CL 600 V12 2001
Used to own 1938 S-Type Tourer S34, CV8 MkII 104/2229 and CV8 MkIII 112/2457
Author of Jensen: The Surviving 3 1/2 & 4 1/4 Litre Cars
Alvis Speed 25 SC Charlesworth Saloon 1938
Mercedes CL 600 V12 2001
Used to own 1938 S-Type Tourer S34, CV8 MkII 104/2229 and CV8 MkIII 112/2457
Author of Jensen: The Surviving 3 1/2 & 4 1/4 Litre Cars
- Richard Calver
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Rolls rebody
The body number on the surviving Jensen body is 9952. That's a higher number than the job numbers on the H-types, but not by much. 9952 could have been part of a parallel but contemporary range of number allocations (the jobs were not all numbered in one sequence). As a guess, you could say this means the body was built at least by 1939, but it may have been a postwar job, as three of the "pre-war" Jensens were. In that sense, it could be expected to reflect the generic S or H-type body lines.
Re: Name that car
This ones always intrigued me ... its a Rolls-Royce Silver Dawn (chassis number SHD50) by H.J.Mullinger with a "Jensen" hood!
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Re: Name that car
I think it was not uncommon for older quality cars to receive new bodies to make them look more modern. I heard of a Bentley (a Cricklewood - proper Bentley!) receiving a Jensen body in the late 1930s, though I've never managed to get a copy of the photograph I was shown by the owner. The Bentley survives today, but with a Van den Plas replica body.
Mike
Mike
Mike
(former JOC Early Cars Registrar)
(former owner of 116/3328 and P66)
Still own 1938 Jensen HL1 drophead
(former JOC Early Cars Registrar)
(former owner of 116/3328 and P66)
Still own 1938 Jensen HL1 drophead
Re: Name that car
Anybody know what this pre-car is and how many were made?
- Richard Calver
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Moveo
It's the Moveo, one of the first cars bodied by the Jensen brothers. That's the first and possibly only one. There may have been a second.