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Heat Resistant Primer

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by John Staddon » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:03 pm

Can anyone recommend a heat resistant primer, or etch primer, that doesn't cost the earth, doesn't need to be cured in an oven and can be brush applied? I want to paint some of the engine parts on the early Interceptor in Austin silver-green and the supplier recommends a primer but doesn't supply one and can't tell me what I should use!

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by Grant » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:13 pm

I use this acid etch primer here John, I pay less than this from a paint shop in Crawley but sadly they don't have a website, it's a bit dearer on this link but I guess because it includes postage, .. but I wouldn't be worried if it was just a large tin of primer from any local shop John for your job there :wink: >>> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/322102576321?ul_noapp=true
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by John Staddon » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:33 pm

Thanks Grant, but in what way is that paint heat resistant, or is heat resistance not as important as I am assuming it is? I am going to paint the engine as well so this query isn't about things in the engine bay, it's about the engine, and right now various bits that attach to the engine).

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by Grant » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:54 pm

Any engine ancillaries John you can use this primer and I personally would paint the engine block with Kur-Rust which is a really good base and then go over with your paint-colour on the block John, that's what I have always done in the past and never had any problems. Alot of these engine enamels don't normally require a primer, but, if you want to play safe all the way.. here is some high temp primer here in stock and only a tenner a tin but spray on again and I see that you are asking for paint on JohnBoy so maybe not what you are looking for Image >>> https://www.frost.co.uk/vht-high-temper ... -p148.html :wink:
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by John Staddon » Wed May 01, 2019 2:01 pm

I don't have a problem with aerosols other than the cost, there is not much paint in a small tin, but I may have to bite the bullet and go down the aerosol route, though I had already found the Frost product you found and ruled it out as it needs heating to 30 degrees C to cure it, though it can be cured by engine heat as well so I have asked if it will still cure after it has been overpainted (and if it can be overpainted before curing), I haven't had a reply yet.

I also found a product in a £25 tin from Heritage Paints that is heat resistant to very high temperature and I bought some and tried it with very poor results, it can't really be brushed on as it has no 'flow' so shows every brush mark, unfortunately I didn't ask if it could be brushed before I bought it (I should have done as there is no technical info at all on the Heritage Paints website) so i have found that out the hard way.

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by John Staddon » Thu May 02, 2019 10:09 am

A follow up to the last post. Frost Restorations were helpful when I talked to an advisor, the VHT primer can be overpainted before it's cured and is suitable for overpainting with the Austin metallic light silver/green paint I want to use, it will also take over Kurust which is necessary as for the smaller parts I have already Kurusted them. Alternatively, and this is the interesting bit, they recommend POR 15 Metal Prep which can be used instead of a primer, it doesn't work with Kurust however so for the block we would have to get it completely free of rust before painting, which really means bead blasting it (or similar) but as the engine will be completely dismantled I'm sure that can be done.

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by Grant » Thu May 02, 2019 10:38 am

John Staddon wrote:A follow up to the last post. Frost Restorations were helpful when I talked to an advisor, the VHT primer can be overpainted before it's cured and is suitable for overpainting with the Austin metallic light silver/green paint I want to use, it will also take over Kurust which is necessary as for the smaller parts I have already Kurusted them. Alternatively, and this is the interesting bit, they recommend POR 15 Metal Prep which can be used instead of a primer, it doesn't work with Kurust however so for the block we would have to get it completely free of rust before painting, which really means bead blasting it (or similar) but as the engine will be completely dismantled I'm sure that can be done.John

Well with the Kurust John, use that on that on the block and overpaint with colour on that, it is a really good base.. that will save blasting it :wink: .. I wouldn't be blasting an engine block with anything.. I think that is asking for trouble in the future no matter how good at cleaning it out after you maybe.. other may see it different though.. A chap I know who just does axles refuses to get any casings blasted for this reason :wink:
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by John Staddon » Thu May 02, 2019 1:03 pm

Yes Grant your right, I think I would be stood against a wall and shot for suggesting any sort of media blasting, I have read about the after effects. I think we will end up with the block pickled to clean and descale it, and the bores will need honing at least (first indications are that the engine is in good condition mechanically but we know moisture has got inside a couple of the cylinders so it will need work) so it's possible we'll end up talking to the company that does that about painting it as they will probably want to apply some sort of coating before giving it back. So for the moment I will concentrate on the bits that come off the engine and worry about the block and cylinder head later, and for that the Frost product looks as if it will do for priming (I do see your point about using the Kurust as a base for paint, but I think I will prime as well - I've ordered some so I will use it).

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by jglarkin » Fri May 03, 2019 11:20 pm

I had my block ‘cleaned’ it looked great but it now leaks like a sieve, oil and water!
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by Grant » Fri May 03, 2019 11:28 pm

jglarkin wrote:I had my block ‘cleaned’ it looked great but it now leaks like a sieve, oil and water!

Hello JonBoy :P
How was it Cleaned then Jon? using what?.. and don't sayImage CleanerImage
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by jglarkin » Sat May 04, 2019 7:48 am

Acid dip

http://www.realsteel.co.uk/engineering.pdf

These engines have a horrible thick coating on them, take it off and you might find out why it’s there. The worst leak in the side of the crankcase had to be drilled and plugged, oil streamed down the side of the engine!

The block looked loverly though :?
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by johnw » Sun May 12, 2019 9:34 am

jglarkin wrote:Acid dip

http://www.realsteel.co.uk/engineering.pdf

These engines have a horrible thick coating on them, take it off and you might find out why it’s there. The worst leak in the side of the crankcase had to be drilled and plugged, oil streamed down the side of the engine!

The block looked loverly though :?


Nice to know you have had it properly fixed. Could that have been a previous repair that was sealed up? Or was it obvious pinholes/porosity? On Interceptors/FFs there is normally just the Chrysler green/blue paint with fairly normal black over the top.

I was recently working on a 440 iron head with rotten core plug, and around the core plug seat, there was porosity in the casting which appeared to kick off general corrosion of that particular plug.
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by Joe Schiavone » Sun May 12, 2019 7:52 pm

The factory never used a primer. Check with rattle can VHT high Temp Engine Paint. I do not remember them requiring primer as most paints do. I am a fanannic about being correct went with rattle cam on my motor. 10,000 miles sand no peeling flaking etc. RacerJoe
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by johnw » Mon May 13, 2019 11:43 am

Joe Schiavone wrote:The factory never used a primer. Check with rattle can VHT high Temp Engine Paint. I do not remember them requiring primer as most paints do. I am a fanannic about being correct went with rattle cam on my motor. 10,000 miles sand no peeling flaking etc. RacerJoe

I think John wants to get this exact Austin green and to brush it on, which is not available in the VHT range. Good point though, the VHT rattle can paint might act as a primer. I use the VHT straight on too no primer with no issues. I have also had good results from brush on engine paint from Halfords (possibly VHT), really thin runny stuff. Being thin seems to make it less susceptible to expansion.

Whatever car you use now as a daily driver, I would say try this scheme first on the exhaust manifold, and down pipe, and see where it holds and where not. Cylinder heads are water cooled and usually don't get too hot. Smoothrite on a 383 inlet manifold will only peel around the exhaust crossover/thermal choke area.

John you mention oven curing. I am thinking about making a paint oven out of an insulated filing cabinet and electric oven. Quite a few people are doing this on youtube. I can then DIY powder coat, at least in theory! I would also like to do some metal tempering/hardening, but will likely need a more precisely controlled and hotter oven for that.
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by John Staddon » Mon May 13, 2019 5:36 pm

Yes, this is for the early Interceptor engine which was painted Austin-Healey metallic silver green. AH Spares sell the paint in a tin, Anglo Car Parts sell the same paint in an aerosol, it's cheaper to buy a tin, and I have, as the aerosol provides much less paint for a similar price to a tin. But having experimented with primer and paint on some small engine parts I find that whilst the primer, from an aerosol, goes on nicely the paint really needs to be sprayed to get the mother of pearl effect I would like, it will brush on but as you might expect brushing spreads the pigment out in the direction of the brush strokes. I think the answer is going to be a coat, or two, of brushed on paint finished off with a light coat of aerosol applied paint to give the final finish. But that's some way off as the engine needs rebuilding first. I don't need to worry about curing the paint with heat, that will happen the first time the engine runs (and it's only the primer that needs heat to finally cure, though I have to say it sets like a rock in a couple of hours, sufficient to sand down with no problems).

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