Timing Gears
Re: Timing Gears
Awesome! From where is that photo taken?
- Phil Hayes
- Posts: 418
- Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2006 10:24 pm
- Location: cheshire
Re: Timing Gears
retired mechanic future father in law.... That was a good move! Could do with one of those.Richie wrote:Along with a general service - oil n filters and greasing etc, assuming that my 120,000 mile 383 still has the fibre timing gears in place, I plan on replacing them with metal ones. I'll be doing the job with my retired mechanic future father in law but before getting stuck in, What's involved? Any pitfalls to be aware of? Any top tips would be appreciated.
SP 131-4777
Re: Timing Gears
Unfortunately that picture was taken after having removed the intake manifold and valley pan. Not worth doing if you have no reason to remove them, I just happened to be replacing my lifters.Richie wrote:Awesome! From where is that photo taken?
Jon
C-V8 112-2355
541rr 3624319
https://www.flickr.com/photos/62752698@N06/albums
"The renovation story" (a large collection of rubbish pictures of a rotten car).
C-V8 112-2355
541rr 3624319
https://www.flickr.com/photos/62752698@N06/albums
"The renovation story" (a large collection of rubbish pictures of a rotten car).
- Martin R
- Posts: 5942
- Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 11:04 pm
- Location: Chipping Norton, & Sydney Australia
Re: Timing Gears
Here's a close-up picture of my old "plastic coated" timing gear and chain. As you can see, with NO PLASTIC left, it's obvious how badly the chain aligns and how close it must have been to slipping and destroying the valves etc...... I was VERY lucky.
FF MK1 119/100
Interceptor MK3 136/8514
JOC Member 8905
Interceptor MK3 136/8514
JOC Member 8905
Re: Timing Gears
Was the chain noisy, running in this condition?
Re: Timing Gears
No tension left:
That has to make noise. But my engine ran only a few seconds when buying the car and the heaviest noise was the missing exhaust gasket. 1968 Interceptor MK1 115/2950 (See full restoration-story: http://www.interceptor-mk1.de)
1967 Interceptor MK1 117/2609 R.I.P †
BMW 550iAT (lpg)
BMW 120d
JOC-Member 9838
1967 Interceptor MK1 117/2609 R.I.P †
BMW 550iAT (lpg)
BMW 120d
JOC-Member 9838
Re: Timing Gears
so...the best way of seeing the gears would be via the dizzy hole with a webcam on a stick then?
- Martin R
- Posts: 5942
- Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 11:04 pm
- Location: Chipping Norton, & Sydney Australia
Re: Timing Gears
Errr, yes, particularly at start-up but then driven gently seemed OK!AH1951 wrote:Was the chain noisy, running in this condition?
OK enough that I drove it approx 50 miles from Birmingham to Appleyards in Ilkeston
FF MK1 119/100
Interceptor MK3 136/8514
JOC Member 8905
Interceptor MK3 136/8514
JOC Member 8905
- Martin R
- Posts: 5942
- Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 11:04 pm
- Location: Chipping Norton, & Sydney Australia
Re: Timing Gears
A scope camera of some description is, I believe how mine was identified.Richie wrote:so...the best way of seeing the gears would be via the dizzy hole with a webcam on a stick then?
FF MK1 119/100
Interceptor MK3 136/8514
JOC Member 8905
Interceptor MK3 136/8514
JOC Member 8905
Re: Timing Gears
You can just check how much slack is in the chain as an indicator if it should be replaced.
With the distributor cap removed, turn the crank backwards (counter clockwise) by hand with a socket or if a manual car, put in gear and roll (easier with sparkplugs removed) and wait for the distributor rotor to move. I usually rotate the engine so the timing mark on the damper is around 10-degrees before TDC. Now turn the crank clockwise while watching for the distributor rotor to move. If it has more than 8-degrees of slack then the timing set should be replaced.
These billet, 9-way timing chain sets from 440 Source are really nice. I have the 3-bolt versions on two of my muscle cars and the Jensen will be getting one soon.
http://store.440source.com/Billet-1-Bol ... /114-1002/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
With the distributor cap removed, turn the crank backwards (counter clockwise) by hand with a socket or if a manual car, put in gear and roll (easier with sparkplugs removed) and wait for the distributor rotor to move. I usually rotate the engine so the timing mark on the damper is around 10-degrees before TDC. Now turn the crank clockwise while watching for the distributor rotor to move. If it has more than 8-degrees of slack then the timing set should be replaced.
These billet, 9-way timing chain sets from 440 Source are really nice. I have the 3-bolt versions on two of my muscle cars and the Jensen will be getting one soon.
http://store.440source.com/Billet-1-Bol ... /114-1002/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
1973 Jensen Interceptor III 140/8400
1971 Dodge Charger 500
1969 Dodge Coronets: a 500 model, a R/T hardtop model and a R/T Convertible
1971 Dodge Charger 500
1969 Dodge Coronets: a 500 model, a R/T hardtop model and a R/T Convertible
Re: Timing Gears
Remains from the nylon coating of the camshaft gear, retrieved from the oil pump pickup gauze.
The future ain’t what it used to be.
Interceptor Mk1 LHD & RHD
GT LHD
Interceptor Mk1 LHD & RHD
GT LHD
Re: Timing Gears
Wow, what happened? And unexpected or was it making noise beforehand?
1973 Interceptor Mk. III
1976 Interceptor Mk. III Convertible
1976 Jensen GT
Jaguar E-type OTS
Triumph TR4A
1976 Interceptor Mk. III Convertible
1976 Jensen GT
Jaguar E-type OTS
Triumph TR4A
Re: Timing Gears
The engine ran very good, no strange noises.
These 383 engines (maybe earlier / later engines as well, at least around 1968) had a nylon coating on the camshaft gear. This was done to make the gear more silent I believe. After some time the nylon disintegrates. The result is that the broken off parts fall into the sump. Martin R shows a pic of his sprocket with all the plastic worn off which must have cause the engine run very badly!
I read about all this and came to the conclusion that I needed to check and while the timing cover is off, it would be wise to replace the timing gears and chain, just as a precaution. As you can see much of the nylon had worn off so the action was really needed. I hope not too much damage has already been done to the engine.
These 383 engines (maybe earlier / later engines as well, at least around 1968) had a nylon coating on the camshaft gear. This was done to make the gear more silent I believe. After some time the nylon disintegrates. The result is that the broken off parts fall into the sump. Martin R shows a pic of his sprocket with all the plastic worn off which must have cause the engine run very badly!
I read about all this and came to the conclusion that I needed to check and while the timing cover is off, it would be wise to replace the timing gears and chain, just as a precaution. As you can see much of the nylon had worn off so the action was really needed. I hope not too much damage has already been done to the engine.
The future ain’t what it used to be.
Interceptor Mk1 LHD & RHD
GT LHD
Interceptor Mk1 LHD & RHD
GT LHD
Re: Timing Gears
what pillock at GM had the dim idear of putting plastic on a drive gear wheel it was always going to fail and cause problems with the debris { no brainer }Christian wrote:That is what you'll find:I agree with Shaun that there will be lots of debris in the sump and the pickup. The sump-sealing will be hard to save after 40 years. And even if you manage to save it, it will be still more difficult to get that old stuff sealed properly again. So I would give the advice to pull the sump, clean sump and pickup, and then replace all the sealings (sump, shaft seal ring and timing cover seal). If you want to reuse the harmonic balancer, get the correct puller. Never pull on the outer circumference.
sticky by name stick at it by nature !!!!
- slotcarone
- Posts: 1666
- Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2010 1:38 pm
Re: Timing Gears
Just letting you guys know almost every American V8 engine from this era has this type of nylon cam gear from the factory. Not just Mopars. Mine went about 20 years ago and also had to remove the oil pan to clean out the nylon pieces from the oil pump pickup. Been fine ever since.
1972 Interceptor III
133-5612
133-5612