Unwanted Heat

[Mark Maniatt]

Hi All,

We took the Beast for a run to Scarborough yesterday and noticed that despite having the control set to either 'cold or cool' a large amount of hot air was still coming into the cabin through the foot well openings.

I might add,the engine temperature was normal.The reverse of this is true in the cold months when we cant get enough heat.

Finally,we have the same problem on one of our Sprinter vans.It turned out that from what Mercedes have told me ,the cable that operates the setting lever needs oiling.Although this may not be the case on the Jennie,it is having the same effect.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Regards,

SWEATING LIKE F--- NOT

Leeds

[Keith]

Sounds like a job for Torque issue 1 (published last year) which has a great article on Interceptor Heating & Air-Con fault-finding.

[Steve Payne]

Hi Mark

I think you will find this is Heat Soak. I am convinced this is why Jensen fitted A/C to these cars.

I have insulated my bulkhead and I still get a lot of heat from the engine/gearbox. I find on a cool day I dont need the heater on as there is enough warm air coming in.

I have checked my Heater valve and even disconnected the vacuum line just to make sure but it still happens.

It is funny what you say about not enough heat in the winter because I have also found this when the temperature drops to below freezing. I had to resort to foil in the front grille a couple of years ago just to get my heater to work properly, I think the reason for this is we tend to set these cars up to get rid of as much heat as possible for summer use i.e. High flow thermostats, high flow water pump, large radiators and 160 degrees thermostats ect ect so when we actually need the heat we have dumped it.

I think this winter I am going to fit a 180 thermostat and see if that helps the heater but as far as keeping cool I think you will need to get your A/C working. I have a guy near me who charges most system's for about xxx£60 and I can tell you it is well worth the expense. Even if you need your system converting to 134a this usually only adds xxx£30 or xxx£40 to the bill. I have converted mine to use a Sanden Compressor and this gives you more cold air than you will ever need and you use hardly any extra petrol with it on.

Steve

[RAP72]

I have a mark 1/1/2 so do not have the Air Con option. At the Harwood House some kind sole pointed out the foot well vent ( I have only had the car for about 5 years ) We only found one on the driver's side the other may have been carpetted over, but I will look at some stage. On the run home it seemed just as warm. However, I found another the heat was getting in; I found that that when the engine was rebuilt and reinstalled 2 rubber bungs had been left out. (these are the ones that allow you to get at the rear spark plugs - so I am told) Fortunately Jason at Rejen found me one and I have taped over the other one until he can find another.

Whist on the subject does anyone have a Spare? ( I realise that I am asking for a bung but have nothing to do with the Government!). Secondly what would it cost in time, effort and pounds to put Air Con in? Has anyone done it?

[Steve Payne]

Fitting A/C should be fairly straigtforward but very time consuming.

You would have to remove the dash as to get access to the heater box, replace the heater box with one form a later car with an evaporator in it. You will need to put a condensor in front of the Radaiator and all the associated pipes. I would use a Sanden type compressor as they use a lot less energy and pump a lot better so produce a lot more cold air.

I would have thought it would take somebody who is reasonalby competant 4 to 5 days to do this not allowing for any problems.

The nice thing once you have A/C is you wonder how you ever did without it.

Steve

[Mark Maniatt]

Hi Steve & Rap,

Interesting post chaps.With reference Rap's foot well vent.There will be one the same on the passenger side.Sounds like your guess about being covered by carpet would be correct.

Further to my comments re:'Heat Soak' Steve, I thought that this problem had been cured by the time of the Mk III's but,and please forgive me for saying this,if Steve Payne has the same situation in his car then I feel a whole lot better.If you can't fix it I'll just have to live with it.My A/C works a treat,however,the system shows its age by the fact that the chilled air only comes out of the 'eyeball' vents and not the foot vents as in a modern car.Hence,frosted nipples and baked ankles.This is not to be confused with heat coming into the car through the windows which the A/C easily copes with.

I fear that one of the main problems Jensen owners can encounter is that of comparing an,( at the very least),thirty year old car to a modern car.I know because I inadvertently do this from time to time after driving our Audi.The A/C in the Audi could cause frostbite quite easily where as the Jensen will still drop the temperature very well but is not in the same league.I put this syndrome down to the superior feeling one develops through owning one of these cars.By this I mean that it is difficult to accept that these great machines are not the tops in just about every department known to man.Well there not QUITE

One final question aimed in Steve's direction.When I get the A/C re-charged,I guess I will require the old gas.Is the modern gas which I realise probably won't do on the older systems superior as far as providing colder air or is it the compressor or system in general that make's the difference

TTFN

'HOT ANKLES MANIATT'

[Steve Payne]

Hi Mark

Your A/C should if using the original gas ( r12 ) be able to Freeze chickens. I would suspect some body has put modern gas in (134a) or equivalant. If this is not done properly it will not work properly. The expansion valve MUST be changed as the hole is a differant diameter together with a few other mods. The ngine cooling fans should come on as soon as the pressure gets to a pre set level or the whole system will never fuction properly.

The vents in the foot wells should pass a small amount of cold air but they tend to only do this if the Eye Balls are shut.

If you want proper Cold A/C there are two ways to do this is either get some R12 and then find somebody to refill your system with it ( Highly illegal ) or replace you compressor with a Sanden. The Sanden is designed to run on 134a, it will pump a lot more refrigerant and as long as a few mods are done it will probably be as cold as your Audi. I have recently had to fit a themostat in the wiring of my A/C to save me switching it on and off. With my system running after half an hour the interior of my car is to cold. If you buy a new compressor this modification should cost about xxx£500 to xxx£600 but is money well spent.

Steve

[Mark Maniatt]

Hi Steve,

Thanks for the advice as always.However,as my mechanical know how does not extend beyond the 'chamois leather' :you will I hope not be offended when I point out that your last reply turned into something resembling 'Swahili' shortly after,Hi Mark.As such I feel it might be prudent to make my way down to an A/C specialist ASAP.

Incidentaly,as my beast likes a drink I fret, somewhat, over using the A/C for fear of reducing my already paltry 11 MPG down to single figure MPG motoring. With this in mind I recall recently reading your posting which was part of your reply to LPG etc; and your comments re;overdrive and your pointing out that this has been the greatest benefit to improving MPG in your car.The cost did'nt seem too prohibitive and I think this could be the way forward for my car.I will have to talk to you about this in the coming months(or Stoneleigh if your there)

Thanks again Steve,

TTFN,

Leeds Bloke

[Peter Burton]

Hi guys,
My oh my; what a little sunshine does to the brain as it seems like only yesterday in these pages Inti owners were simply not refilling their systems, disconnecting or even removing them completely in the effort for economy. Now it appears air con is a must. The problem with air con is that if fitted it must work correctly as if inoperative the windows mist up on damp days, which is a real pain. Those lucky(?) enough not to have the dreaded a/c have a different heater system which I found fine, if not better. Personally I use that little black rocker switch and open the windows if only to listen to the fantastic V8 burble, but appreciate those of you stuck in traffic inhaling lungfulls of Browns vat, a/c on with the glass firmly shut is the only way to survive, poor you.
If I recall only the later series 3's did not have the footwell sliding fresh air vents fitted in the outer (black) kick plates, even though the box like tubes running along the top of the inner wings are still there. Were the ends welded closed on these later cars?.
I agree with Steve, R12 frosted my eyebrows but 134 is less efficient. And yes it is straightforward to have the system converted to R134 by any firm that knows what it is all about, ignore any bull about oil or gas not mixing, if they say that they are con. merchants and go elsewhere. One thing though, my poor old compressor rattles more on the new stuff and it has been used infrequently for well over a year now., usually on damp days.
So; it you have a/c, make it work; if not don't bother. just think of all the money you are saving!
All the best, Peter.

[Mark Maniatt]

Hello 'My Pastie Munching Chum,' ,

Never mind bloody air con.How about getting an e-mail up to the 'Fat Leeds Bloke' ASAP.You owe me around '4' at the last count

That big end must be fixed on that computer of yours by now

For those wondering what the hell's going on let me explain.Mr Peter Burton, late of the Cornish Riviera, has been spending far too much time playing with his 'Beast' and not enough time firing off e-mails to his fish & chip chomping pal in 'Gods own County'.

There.You've been named and shamed

Get punching that keyboard !!!!!!

All the best my old mate,

Mark

[soggykitkat]

Hiya Mark,
We had a similar experience with "the old REK". I'm fortunate in that mine has already been converted (light blue cap and a red cap) to R134a gas. If you are using R12 then any service centre that detects the gas shuts down their equipment. They can get into serious trouble releasing it into the enviroment........I think there is a custodial sentance for repeat offenders!!!!
Now if you have the afformentioned caps (the old R12 gas filled from on top of the dryer unit, the new type should be on either side of the compressor) then you are in luck. Plenty of places will refill at a cost of about xxx£70 plus greedy Gordons cut. However being an enterprising sort like myself, toddle off to Halfords and buy their refill in a can, costs xxx£39.95. Follow the instructions, attatch cannister to low pressure side (under the light blue cap) and press the button. Really is easy peasy. To think I've dragged the missus and kids around the country sweating our bits off. Now the old REK is positively chilly inside and in the weather of the last couple of weeks, it has performed as good as any modern day car. But I don't grin at all when I'm driving the Jap/Euro boxes

Regards
Lewi

PS If you need some piccies, let me know and I'll see if I can post them on the forum

[Mark Maniatt]

Hi Lew

Thanks for the post.No,I have just checked and there is no blue and red cap unfortunately. I guess I have the old gas.When I get time I will get it round to a specialist A/C outfit and have it checked out.

In the mean time I will get an e-mail off to you later today.

All the best mate,

Mark

[Steve Payne]

Hi Mark

If you have the old gas you have actually got the better stuff as long as you have enough of it, if you look at the top of the drier (round black thing in the left hand front of the engine bay) there is a window, with the A/C running there should be little or no visable bubbles. If it is like froth there is definatly not enough gas, if it is clear there is plenty.

Just because you do not have the red and blue caps it does not mean it has not been converted, it might have been done on the cheap. If you look at the 2 connections coming out of the bulkhead the lower on has a right angled valve, this should say 134a on one of its faces if it has been conveterted properly. If it stil has r12 gas in the system and the window in the drier has no bubbles the top of the 2 connections coming out of the bulkhead should be ice cold, if it is just cool to cold it is r134a.

I hope this helps

Steve

[Mark Maniatt]

Hi Steve,

Thanks for the advise mate.I will go and check this evening and report back.

By the way Steve.Why don't you relate to the other's on the forum the story you told me the other day regarding the fuel consumption of a Lightning Fighter Jet.I still can't get over that one yet I guarantee no one will ever again complain about a Jensen being thirsty.

All the best,

Mark

[RAP72]

Mark’s reference your comment on the Lightning. Steve probably has more knowledge of Lightning Fuel consumption than I but when I was training to be a Fighter Controller ( a course which I failed because I was so good I did not need missiles to achieve a kill as I could, apparently do it without!) Anyway I remember being told that if push came to shove at full reheat I would have 30 minutes to get the Lightning F6 from the runway, to the target and back again; and that it used tons of fuel!